Proposal to improve market stall data modeling, automation, and awesomeness

Okay sure, but why on Earth would you want to keep managing the system manually.

At best it’s a distraction, and at worst it’s a point of genuine conflict.

Also why have a limited number of people buying from the rest of the players when more people could just be selling.

Stall owners already buy goods from players directly now, but the system as it is just isn’t engaging enough of the games population in a positive way.

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I’ll see if I can find some old post, but the devs said they were going to automate the process. And I rarely buy goods form other players, it’s a real hassle, having the stalls be able to buy goods would have a massive impact on the economy.

but what does that mean? Basically setting a sell and a buy price for items they choose to carry?

It still doesn’t address the limited number of people who can run stalls, but I could see that at least being helpful. Still I stand by my recommended changes, and automated buying wouldn’t be a bad approach to add to existing model.

They have also said multiple times that if the population grows they will add more stalls in town. Right now, 19 stalls is more than enough to support the current population.

If you introduce the option to buying in stalls I think it will allow an easier control of the current game economy. I don’t think adding buying option to stalls at this moment is a good idea. I would rather have a free-for-all market, global system, when giving players the ability to buy items when not in-game.

At the same time however if the players compete at trying to buy items it would lead to a more accurate representation of the value of items. However given the limited market, in both population and players that have gotten stalls, I don’t think that it will be likely for a lot of the tradeable items.

The system definitely needs to be more streamlined. Both in terms of the UI, and losing and managing a stall. I would also like if they introduced some type of penalty for having bid in excess, however with more players joining, once we have ~20 rich people the price of stalls might not be worth it. For some reason I feel like the current stall system is not an adequate one once the ball gets rolling.

Oh! On a slightly different note, I (or we) would also be curious to know some of the intentions of the stalls. What I mean is, are they suppose to feel like real life trader stalls? Are they for guilds, for individual people? To get rid of excess supplies, to establish respectable trading chains (X’s Fish stall, Y’s Runesmithing Trade shop, Z’s Dragon Bonanza)?

I highly disagree, but that is because the stalls are player driven and 1 player per stall.

In my opinion, the system as i it is right now is not only bad from a gameplay point of view, but it also has maintenance time for both developers and players that would be better spent elsewhere.

For ease, i will quote a post i made in an earlier now sort of lost thread on how i see the system would work better for all parties involved:

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I kind of like the idea of leaving a lot at a npc and having a open in game bid for the items. So not a in game auction house, but a once per week/month real time auction with some in game help to see lots place bids.

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So like an NPC driven world event? That could work, as long as the other changes were in place to make more markets available.

@OndeTv I agree with most of your points, though I don’t know how much simpler the system you propose would make things.

Another cool idea I had was to have your character show up running the stall when you are logged out, instead of an NPC.

Only thing is that people would have to schedule their play time to make that auction event. That would suck from a scheduling standpoint, esp with a global game.

Could be an all day event @Hexno, and if it happened weekly in game it wouldn’t be a super big deal if you missed it since your inventory would be with your character (assuming proper data modeling changes).

Most of the “complex” stuff is behind the scenes. The average player would only see the simple side though:

  • go to a stall, attempt to put an item up far sale and either be ok with the fee or think hmm, i think i’ll find a less “crowded” stall where its cheaper
  • go to a stall, press the search interface for that stall and look for your desired item (or go through its listing)
  • go to an auctioneer, use the search interface, find the most favorable deal among all stalls and get the specific stall location and number of your item

:wink:

Yea, but a searchable auction house similar to WoW would be way more convenient than bidding through a NPC event. :frowning:

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Agreed, but if they want to be different then I am trying to at least bring forward ideas that would fit their vision and better meet the needs of the players.

I think from both a development and usability perspective a Bazaar is a lot easier to use and manage, but I also know they want a more quaint and person driven market experience too.

@OndeTv on your notes, yes, but I am concerned with offering highly complex solutions from a development perspective because they are much harder to implement. Ideally we can offer the Development Team constructive solutions that are both easy to implement, and use.

I see where your thoughts are heading, but it really isn’t very complex on the back end. It is just a series of lists which is already in the game. Then theres temporarily fetching lists, combining them and sorting on them which is also very standard. And, adding some attributes to those lists or list items (item id, location, stall number) for that part.

The fee logic is extremely basic in itself, and could probably be done in less than 30 lines of code.

Overall the logic in the system is comparable to normal database operations. I would wager that the largest work load would be on a well working UI for the searches and adding the npcs/auctioneers.

Yeah, and that is why I lean toward a simple supply and demand based price model.

I am not sure why though, as the general game itself is vastly more complex than my proposal (heck, just handling controller input is more complex) :wink:

I like to suggest very simple solutions so you don’t have much of an excuse not to do them if they represent a significant improvement to user experience, but I also welcome more complex changes as long as they are likewise positive.

Do what Marvel did for the movies! Listen to the overwhelming support of your fans!

The simplest solutions often operate on the existing ruleset though. While that isn’t a bad thing, it rarely changes inherently bad rulesets though :smiley:

That being said, i generally agree with you. Anything in a (alpha, beta, early access) game setting that creates value within the existing system is usually a plus, at least short term.

This is exactly why I keep bringing auction house up, it would make it so people can easily buy and sell stuff so everyone can benefit from it rather than a select few

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