Thoughts about the current economy cash flow in, cash out

So I was thinking about the current economy and want to just put some thoughts out how the money in the game in flowing in and out.

Ways of increasing the dram flowing in the game (as far as I can think off)

  • Gear shards, and any other item that is sell-able to the apprentice smith.This can be a big contributer to the money increase in the game even though the sell prices of the individual items are very low. But the quantity of the items are very high.
  • Killing mobs can drop direct dram just like the items you can sell.
  • Completing quests of any type gives you dram rewards
  • Completing public events?
  • Completing dungeons or even killing a single trash drop in a shard (see pop-ups of 700 dram rewards for just killing a single trash group in the dungeon)

Ways for dram to be lowered in the game

  • Apprentice smith repairing gear (although very low cost and rare occurence)
  • Buying items from the mission vendors and any other vendor in Highsteppe. (Done very rarely or is a single time buy, except for pet treats xD)
  • A player stops playing with more then 0 dram worth and doesn’t pass it on to someone else xD
  • Buying the dram mount or dram dye. The one items that will safe us all :joy: (not really that popular to actually do that lol)
  • The small tax on the auction house trades.
  • Transmogs lose small amounts of dram. (reasonable but also mostly not used by a lot of beginners and not appealing enough to make up for the money sink because that is a relatively rare occurrence depending on the player)
  • Single time chest buy 10k and 100k

Noticeable stuff in the game that neither drains or adds to the economy dram, but can seem like it

  • Rare over-world drops and GRINDER drops. Even though you can create more of them by getting them dropped, the only way you convert that into dram is getting someone to buy the item. Then that person can always destroy the item to get the transmog but the same amount of dram is still present in the economy.
  • Value increase and value decrease of player economy items. Even if items get worth more or less the total dram everyone has still stays the same.
  • Drinking potions. The potion was made from items that can be sold (to the apprentice smith) for dram but has not been sold so it never became dram. This means nothing was added or lost to the dram amount in the game. (same for any other item that can be created and then destroyed in some way. It is an item sink, not a dram sink. But still important in the game to have this.)

I am noting here there is a severe lack of dram sinks in comparison to the dram gain. Am I missing something?

Edit: The amount of options are there but the difference in value between the dram gain and dram sinks is insane. You can have 10 options to make dram and 10 to lose dram. But if the 10 options to make dram are gaining 8x more then the options that lose dram it is still unbalanced.

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The dram Mount!
No seriously, there are almost no dramsinks. A bit of tax on bought and sold items at the auction house and the eventual market stall price.

Omg forgot the dram mount :scream: will add it xD

The dram mount that like 3 people have bought? AH is a good example of a continuous dram sink, player owned stalls will do the same too once they are readded (chests are there now and been on the AH items so probably getting close)

Other than that I can’t think of any dram sinks that you haven’t already covered which is why people wont take millions of dram for the overworld drops, cause why would they? They have no need for it

You are missing the dram dyes.

There is one more other interesting thing that makes me think now. There is the dram balance and the item balance. And they balance each other.

If dram increases and the amount of items in the game increases too then the price per item stays the same. The only thing is that this means slowly over time ppl will get too much stuff which is unnecessary.

There are more ways for items to be removed from the pool but there are also way faster ways to obtain them. I personally think this is still increasing the amount of items in the game too. So looking it that way increasing the amount of dram in the game is just balancing out the the price per item in the game. But that is like I said before bad news long terms. Everyone who plays long enough will overflow with items. Which is happening I can tell you xD

What would happen though if dram is slowly lowing though because you have to lose more dram then you gain?:

  • This means over time items become worth less because no-one has the dram for it to buy them
  • Ppl will start to feel they have to rather try to get the resources and items themselves.
  • This brings an overflow in items in the economy and the items become even worth less because ppl otherwise not buy them :thinking:
  • So now the dram balance will keep lowering until it reaches a point of equalization where it is not lowering or raising because of the nature of ppl willing to to work for adding some extra dram to the economy from farming or not farming for dram. Dram should become fine and equal but now the worth of items idk if that will balance or keep going to a state of worthless.
  • Edit: Actually back to this, it might even lower the item count long term because more items will be sold to get the dram back xD

I don’t fully oversee it but I guess having more gold sinks will give a less bad effect then having to few.

I bought 4, have you gotten any since reborn?

Transmogs are also a small way of removing dram, not a high amount or that often but it slowly adds up when you get new gear and transmog it all or fancy a new look

There is also 1 time buy of 10k and 100k chest tab expansion, but that is not a continuous thing so it’s kinda meh

Added them with their flaw in being good sinks :sweat_smile:

There really isn’t much of an economy in Orbus.

I have no desire to sell anything because I have no desire to buy anything.

Everything that I’ve wanted that didn’t drop as a finished item (potions, runes, etc.) I was able to easily craft myself.

The money in, money out isn’t the problem (although it would be if the economy poofed into existance)…the problem is that the world has very little need for commerce/trade. And, actually, I don’t necessarily think that its a problem.

You know what I find interesting about those overworld drops and GRINDER drops, they add to the motivation of ‘stealing’ dram from someone else that earned it with their creation of money. So it lowers the players need to add dram to the economy and also increased the chance of that person together with the buyer using that money for a money sink.

So even though those special drops seem to be not influential at first glance, they are actually preventing ppl from creating dram if they need dram. I don’t think there are enough of such items though :thinking: those drops are extremes btw. I guess that is why the sell price on the Apprentice smiths of items are way lower then the player prices.

So actually how more ppl trade with each other, how less money will be added to the economy :open_mouth:

Why the f’ did I not learn to think about these things in Economy class when I still used to be in school instead of the boring shit xD

I was thinking about this the other day as well. I realised I was sat on almost 500k dram, what do i want to buy with this?

I got the 100k extra chest tab and bought a couple 1 off transmogs from the vendors. In oldbus I used to buy potions somewhat frequently but this time around I made a batch with friends and so will not be buying potions for atleast a month or two of constant daily use. The GRIND transmogs are another possible 1 time buy but that also removes me from lvling the GRIND device myself so unless I really want something I doubt I will buy any of them.

Dyes are something I’ve bought/sold in the past but its hardly a constant dram sink. Tiles and tilesets are something people have tried to sell me but I just make my own as its usually just a 1 off. I do buy ores currently for crafting as I haven’t farmed ores in a while but again not a constant dram sink.

Fish scent attractor potions was something I would have bought but couldn’t find any on the AH when I looked. I just ended up crafting and aging 20 myself.

All gather-able plants are generally worthless IMO and no one wants them apart from potion crafters but even then they just make/use/sell potions and don’t bother with the ingredients.

I generally don’t feel like there’s anything worth buying consistently, only ‘one offs’ are something i consider buying. In oldbus, Reagents used to be something being constantly sold/bought but they now constantly drop so its become another low worth item that might as well just be sold to the smith.

There seems to be a lack of player to player trade. we have player to vendor. if that’s good or bad I don’t know. When is the tinkerer craft coming out? that might hopefully bring some trade to the game.

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The mount is ridiculously expensive (almost half of the current dram-cap one can have) , it is just a cosmetic and so are dyes. Nothing of that enhances your game. I’d put down 200k easily for another tab in the chest which actually gives me something meaningful.
A mount that is faster than other mounts would also be something to save up dram for. Or which flies. Or…

Other than that 99% of my dram comes from trading and half of it from doing so in the OG where 10-20 people had the monopoly on that, due to the limited number of stalls. Before that I farmed my *ss off with mobs and shard-selling and what not to even reach the 100k for the chest-tab. So not sure if everyone swims in dram or got no issues getting very much, specially not new players.

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I was also thinking about the effectiveness of money sinks being very problematic because of the difference between the money of ppl. A rich person won’t lose a lot of money with the same money sink. So I was also think something like a group money sink might reduce this. For your fellowship by contributing money for your fellowship. Single players can give more. Or something in other group content.

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Dram cap should be 5 mill since a few weeks ago.

I found, before Reborn, I would struggle really hard just to get 100k and if someone wanted to earn that much dram they would need to invest time and effort to get it. Now you just play and get flooded in dram with the flow of money coming in being so much higher then money being spent ( or atleast I don’t need/ buy anything).

Question for the poor people of orbus: What do you spend all your money on? How are you poor?

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I’m not in a fellowship so I don’t know if its a thing or not. But I saw in another thread about wanting crafting stations in the guild house. Make them huge dram sink and give the fellowship a way to hang out while crafting. 1 alchemy station 100K the 2nd 200k the 3rd 400k or what ever seems fair.

Or even make it rent, so the fellowship has to keep enough dram in an account to keep the crafting stations so it’s not a one time thing

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We should be able to buy minor Lvl 30 potions for gold from vendor.