Class Balancing

#1

I was rather excited to see how far we could push the current dungeons when they scaled… But that would probably exclude myself , not beeing a mage in the current form.

Obviously it is high time for some classbalance among dps. Probably something along mages getting a deminished return just like ranger if they fire faster then 1/sec, and scoundrel getting some more DOT rather then burst damage and minor buffs to the party.

2 Likes
Evening out DPS
Patch going out Wed Sept 4th & Blog post
#2

still no word on balancing… any of the 100s of super unbalanced things in all aspects of the game that have been being talked about for months, some even years?yes, literally years some of these problems have been happening for

2 Likes
#3

Why make Mage worse when they could just make every other class better?

5 Likes
#4

Because the difference between good mages and bad mages is to greate, and the usual solution to one class having up to 3x higher max dps compared to the next class would be to place a cap on it.

Considering this cap has already implimented to every other class in the game, tell me @Sift should we fix all other classes, or just mage?

#5

Kinda how it goes when a class is based on 100% skill

Fix the other classes. Most people can agree that mage is the most mechanically complicated and difficult class, and this is what makes it fun to play. Why take a class that is well made and working fine and take it down to the level of other classes that might not be as well made or working as well. Remove the cap on ranger, make the hit detection on warrior better so they can get more than 5 hits per second (those are the only two caps that are not directly related to how the class was made).

1 Like
#6

for rangers imo, there should be way more emphasis on hitting targets… and please for the love of orbus, get rid of the precision timer… it just makes the class turn into ‘slow rapidity’. give us something else instead (like bulls eyes on targets or something)

#7

I think you are sort of missing the point. Orbus devs have shown they are only capable of doing the bare minimum, so asking them to modify every class is too tall an order. Also, no one is asking for the mage skill factor to be removed, instead they are asking for diminishing returns on casting extremely quickly. This means casting faster will always do more dps than casting slower, but removes the crazy scaling issue where mages who can cast 2 spells a second do twice the damage of those who can cast 1 per second.

#8

Being 2 times as good and putting in 2 times the effort should have 2 times the results.

EDIT: Maybe if people asked for what they actually wanted instead of what they think the devs can handle, the game would be in a better place right now.

2 Likes
#9

Okay, then enjoy every other dps class being useless at high level play.

I understand the sentiment, but realistically a class that can scale infinitely and linearly is going to cause constant problems. This is especially true because there is no way for the other dps classes to scale infinitely, even if the devs did make changes. Let’s say I had faith in the devs, how would the other dps classes scale infinitely? None of them have the linear damage to action time that mage has, and most are already being pushed to their limits. Other classes shouldn’t be brought along just to add debuffs which further increase mage damage. They may not out dps the absolute best mages, but the current gap in dps is huge, diminishing returns would just help narrow it a little bit.

This is coming from a runemage.

#10

If you are complaining about the damage difference between mages and other classes, why would you want to make one class weaker when you could make all the other classes stronger? That makes no sense. The difference between endgame mage damage and endgame archer damage is pretty small at this point, the difference between scoundrel and every other class is large because they made it super weak, and there is only so much that can be done for shaman because of the way that the class is made. All they have to do is bring endgame shaman and endgame scoundrel up to the level of endgame archer, then everyone is happy.

3 Likes
#11

Because then only the top 0.1% of mages would be competitive and mages who cast 1 spell per second would be doing half the dps of a scoundrel. Again, you are missing the meta issues here. This is off topic so I’m going to stop though.

#12

Its like that for Mage and Ranger right now…

#13

No, they need to:

  • Increase runemage base damage
  • Apply significant diminishing runemage damage returns for casting more than, say, 1 to 1.5s or so per spell, so that damage as a Sift or a Cam is equivalent to what it is now, but damage as a “good” mage is only a couple percent lower and not 1/2 the damage.
  • Increase all other class damages to be in line with runemage as well
#14

I’m assuming what you mean by “good” is 1 spell per second. Like I said before, if someone is putting in half the work as I am, and I am 2 times as good at it than they are, then I should be getting 2 times the results, or else it feels unrewarding.

4 Likes
#15

No it is still rewarding. You still doing for example 1.2x their damage, have a visual cool effect of more spells flying around, lagg everyone around you more so their dps lowers, still have the best utility and dps boost in the game and more… The only moment an end game ranger reaches close to the damage of an end game mage is having a lucky bleed. Thats pure luck bs.

But now I am going to zip too because this is not the topic of this post, make another mage OP post if we want to continue about it :expressionless:

(the posts have been moved to a seperate topic now)

1 Like
#16

Ok, last thing Since people seem to not understand, if the y axis is DPS and x axis is skill, mages have linear growth while other classes have parabolic growth in DPS. Simply increasing or decreasing either group’s DPS will just move the lines horizontally, so the disparity still persists, just more so on one side or the other. The only way to bring top 0.1% mages closer to other top dps classes, without crushing dps for the bottom 95% is to force high-skilled magery into parabolic growth. (Since the other classes cannot be switched to linear growth without entirely reworking their core mechanics).

2 Likes
#17

We should fix all the classes, mage and others alike. All end game content at this point is basically requiring upper tier mages (2x damage at least above other classes). Raise damage on everything INCLUDING mages and then apply a depreciative curve. So sift and others at max tier can still do a couple percent more damage with their skill but also so a good tier mage can match a good tier ranger (at present, good ranger > good mage, while great ranger < great mage)

Patch going out Wed Sept 4th & Blog post
#18

People do understand this but Sift wants to have all other classes also be a linear raise in dps by increase in skill reward system that also does that, right? But that is just too much of an overhaul of all the classes.

#19

If I got a couple extra percent damage over mediocre mages from all my hours of practice, muscle memory building, experimentation, and math, I’d stop playing mage.

Mage doesn’t scale linearly either; I point this out every time people complain about mage. You can’t do more than 3 afflictions at once, which do 3-4 fireballs worth of damage from a single cast, apply weakness, and make up a significant portion of your damage. Afflictions are a bigger boost to slower mages, who have a higher max afflictons to fireballs cast ratio, so we get diminished returns to speed from that.

The only reason I can see for people to want everyone to do the same (within 10% ish) damage as each other is so that everyone can clear the same content, regardless of skill. This isn’t how the game should be and defeats the purpose of improving yourself to beat the hardest enemies.

Make the other classes more rewarding; don’t make mage worse.

4 Likes
#20

if you made a robot that all it did was draw super quickly and you had 144 hz refresh rate, you could totally draw 10 times per second.

If i make a robot shoot optimally on ranger (hit every target, perfect on every shot timer), i would only do 20-30% more dps.

One is linear, one is logarithmic

runemage is the only class in the game whose cap is physical performance and not some hard coded cap or a cap due to timing.

3 Likes