Jelmiry Overlaps... ragequit over fishing?

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#1

So there’s 3 more weeks gone since my last post about this in which I

  • used up all testing resources from the OG (FULL stacks of testing lures, several k throws!!!)
  • used countless str, int, luck, fishing potions
  • invested long blocks of daily 2 x 2.5h, idling in one zone to wait for conditions
  • found Jelmiry a couple times without being able to fish them, at all, or in ridiculously small amounts (like 1-5)

Since there ARE known, better spots and times in the middle of the night (my night = US prime afternoon/evening time), when I can’t play, I am almost sure players in certain timezones are fcked, deliberately. Why do I keep doing that. Well it’s a goal in the game, a vital resource which should be available, for everyone. But nope, seems not. I was never so close to quit Orbus really.

Jelmiry is the main ingredient for endgame 10x potions. But for people in the wrong timezone, with a normal rl, or outside large communities/guilds it is as if those recipes were not in the game. Everyone else I know crafts singles by now.
Oh yea “why not just buy on the market”, well, Jelmiry is not ever on the market anymore (no wonder!) or it’s gone when I wake up since of course majority of trading also happens in US timezone.

So, to go over this in detail, what to do to fish Jelmiry? Same like other rare fish you need to first know the general conditions when it spawns, which are:

Spoilers

rain, night

I won’t spoiler these in the following, but really, knowing conditions spoils nothing for reasons below.

Second and harder thing to know is basic rotation/regularities regarding locations, to be at the right spots, at the right time. For testing these across the world you will need few stacks of reagents to port through zones, lots of testing lures (feather or rotten finger), int potions and hours of time per day. Once you tested and took notes for a while you should know a few patterns and locations (I know 2 slots, so far).
Should be easier after that, right, you should be able to fish some, on a regular basis. An orbus day takes 5h. So to match Jelmiry conditions you need to reserve 2.5h in a row, that is, 2.5h where you don’t really play, JUST watch out for rain, at the right places. This alone is stupid enough already, sorry. I was picking up the headset up every half hour, day by day. Well, but nope, the point is, even this effort does not help you!

The problems why that is so are:

  • it is not always raining during those 2.5h; so in the worst case you sit at your spot, in the right timeslot/night, 2.5h and it was a waste of time because it did not rain
  • if you dare to combine your waiting with testing (porting to other zones in between, testing for nibbles there) you might miss the rain or come too late to get anything; this happened many times to me; the slot is exactly 20mins, often enough I used a luck, str and fishing potion for the last minutes after getting a nibble, just to catch nothing
  • Now the WORST thing, provided you are at a spot, got a nibble, rain just started, finally perfect conditions, you WILL be fcked over, still, if fishing at a Phoenix spot! Both the spots I found, investing incredible amounts of times, are Phoenix ones. I counted catches, got 10 Phoenix before I got 1 Jelmiry. Others would have given up by now; so much for “testing with real lures”; it does not help here and 90% of places with matching conditions seem to be empty anyway, wrong spot, wrong time, no clue, it is impossible to pop a fishing potion+expensive lure just for testing.
    Today I got a nibble, popped luck, fishing, str potions and got nothing, not one catch, only 9 phoenix. With luck potions (most expensive method…) the rate can be around 1:5 in the end, but since the slots is so short what you catch is nothing compared with the mats and potions spent.

I think the whole Jelmiry-requirements are crazy and not thought through, at all. There is so much more mats needed than it is actually worth and, the worst thing, if you seriously go for it, even with known conditions, that is a no-life activity, afais the only one in the game.
All other rare fish can be catched easier by just ‘stumbling’ over them or testing now and then since conditions are less specific. Their slots are much longer, even Kylakin spawned for an hour, so it didn’t matter if you came later. For those who worked out rotations, without the random rain-element these allow to just go there with no need to idle or wait.
IF there’s a random element like that, then at least spawns should be much, much more frequent OR the slots need be longer so testers have a chance to test & fish after that.

So I wished this was changed from the ground up, but the least which really needs to change is that Phoenix should have a different lure already. Its lure screws with other rare fish as well, but with the time-constraints of Jelmiry (and my strong suspicion there’s really only those sh*t spots available during my playtime… i did not ever have nibbles in other zones!) this becomes completely ridiculous.

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#2

I actually like the complexity with fishing the Jelmiry fish and would not like to see anything change with it. You could always buy the fish from other players or make the x1 potions.

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#3

You can make x5 potions for int and crit without Jelmiry too, the time you’ve wasted on waiting around you could spend farming (or just buy) the lure components and stop “testing” the waters for nibbles, this is a very ineffective way of doing it which I’ve told you before, also stop trying to get them in water that gives Phoenix fish, you can get them with no crossover elsewhere which I’m sure you are already aware of so I’m not sure why you are doing it the way you are and then getting mad about it when it doesn’t work out

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#4

Yea while I respect the current situation is frustrating and difficult I personally feel orbus needs to keep this in place for a number of reasons. For starters everyone has the ability to get everything which is good but also bad for some reasons as well. The current auction house market is a testimony to that. For people who know where to get dyes that are currently being sough after and all the locations of fish at times of the day they get a advantage. This advantage doesn’t come without some effort thought you need to either be social (MMO love <3) or really do your own test and studies to learn about different things in the game. This is what makes the game interesting and compelling. If everything was easier to get it would get stale quickly and there would be nothing to seek after. Also these are the top tier end game potions we are talking about and they need a rare ingredient to make them seem like so. My advice would be to just keep testing your methods but start doing it in a more controlled method and perhaps implement a spreadsheet for yourself. This will help you track down the fish better and gather data without double backing too often. Happy fishing friend. :slight_smile:

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#5

People don’t even actually seem to read what I wrote, but anyway… oh I “need to be social” oh tell, with whom, the 20 level 1s which are in HS? (formerly it was 5-10 at these times, on whole server…) This is a general thing, rather adressed to devs about locking out people from resources and a mechanics which is pretty much incompatible with certain timezones.

@Rickness_Voidwalker there is no alternative to testing waters. I get nothing, most of the time, with a fishing potion AND a lure (I usually test with real lures once I got a potion on anyway, like in Hulthines), the spawns are simply too rare, even if conditions all match.
With an int potion and 2 lures I know what’s all in, I get countless nibbles and the rarest one normally on the 1st lure even, IF it is in a lake, at all (which I know from the known rotations). So what can be more effective. Crafting 100s fishing potions and farming rare resources JUST for testing? “stop trying to get them in water that gives phoenix fish” well… does anyone really think I search these places, on purpose??? It’s not that I WANT to find them there, I tried ALL the waters and the phoenix spots (one in HS, one in rainforest) were the only ones where I, ever, had a nibble. To repeat that, I got 2 places with nibbles, two, not more. Going day after day testing ALL the zones at the known conditions, whole morning, all around the map; whenever the conditions match, I test. That simple. Over weeks.
But you don’t play at that time, no one actually does, and slowly I suppose the rotations are designed like that on purpose, so the low-server count times are less frequented; which fcks those over which are plagued enough already with the lack of people for groups and raids etc.
So yea it is not a problem for most, not at all if you CAN play after (eu) midnight or be in US timezone and not at all if you sit in a 30 people-guild with several fishing, communicating and sharing info during that time.

This kind of mechanics was never implemented in the fishing rotations in OG - I had no trouble to “stumble” over the fish I needed, just by doing my regular daily fishing, even found out some rotations without even really looking. I knew there’s other rotations in reborn so I went for it, systematically, weeks long.

And on a general view, there is no balance in the game regarding farming. Everything is handed out to people however a few things, like this one, is so overly hard that apart from some elite guilds knowing “their” spots - and able to play at spawn-time - no one will have access.

As for @DrDidact I don’t think you got what I’m even talking about… “systematically” means to document everything, servertime, condition etc. as for being more social, I was in contact with 10 or more people to exchange info and barely did anything else but test rotations, skipping rl tasks, for weeks. This is what makes me write these posts. It’s not that I sat there 1h and threw away my lure, getting miffed or what y’all think…

To bring my point across, again, I got all the info needed now, I invested my time to find it, but there is no point in it since the mechanics locks the resource to certain factors, specially timezones and super-long slots of waiting/idling for the one random condition; noone really can dig those out who’s got another job than orbus.

So yea, I am done with that topic but there is really no sense or balance in all of this. Most mats are so easy to get it’s ridiculous and very, very few like this fish got a threshold near to impossibility that’s just not what keeps the game alive, neither of it.

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#6

@Metris_Marshmallow if you want fish i can trade you some of mine

#7

This doesn’t really resolve the problem, you know…

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#8

I’m pming you; I actually like hard puzzles in games and very much hoped to get that one also tackled down, but with all the info available it’s already clear it’s pointless or requires to give up my rl and it suffers enough as it is with the actual content I wanna play…

And I’m with Atropos, I think there should be another solution than this.

#9

yeah but if anyone really need the fish i am willing trade what i have

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#10

That’s not what I want, takin ur last few fish :wink: only if you got a regular spot in your timezone then we trade. Rest pm. (Edit: turns out she can’t be online either during those slots… if someone else wants to trade regularly just tell in pm, but who really enjoys to sit at a spot all night anyway.)

#11

Looking through all of these I think to sum up everything, It’s as the title says.

Either:
Please remove overlap with legendary fish
Or add that if the correct 3 piece lure is used only the legendary fish can be caught

Why would anyone try fishing legendary fish when to reasonably find and catch them a lot needs to be invested and if there is an overlap (in this case phoenix and jelmiry) then there’s a high chance of only getting phoenix fish even with all potions + correct lures. This leads to it just not being worth it to ever try catch them in overlapping circumstances.

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#12

Sorry I missed the systematically part you mentioned previously @Metris_Marshmallow. The thing is though the game is balanced in this respect at the current moment to me. These are max tier ingredients for max tier potions to use in dungeons and other events a lot of people in the game really work to get the best times for ect. The trading aspect of the game is available and while I think you have a point in the aspect of fish only being able to be caught in certain conditions I think this is a must to keep the rarity of the fish in tact. I personally do not have a ton of data on fish gathered to know this for certain but I can say that I have talked to a lot of people who seem to not have a problem getting these fish themselves. Sure they don’t walk back into town with enough to fund a army but it is still enough to make their trip somewhat worth it. In a MMO people who spend a ton of time usually get rewarded because they gather more materials, do more objectives, and so on. This aspect of any game is always gonna be in tact or the game will get stale and boring and it looses that interest of a challenge. I think the problem is the game is small in population and you are having a hard time finding someone to trade for these fish with. Perhaps this will be something that will fix itself in time or will just need to be a obstacle to overcome. I am not sure there is a way to fix this without hurting the rarity of the fish or the potions they make in the process. I can state that I spend a lot of time in Orbus myself and just started trying to catch these fish myself and would be willing to trade with you in the future if you want to stay in contact. Perhaps you can help me with some of the materials I have a hard time acquiring myself. :slight_smile: The beauty of trade in MMOS. Also I hope you didn’t think I was insulting you or anything else I was just trying to help and didn’t understand the post clearly in the beginning. I kinda read it as soon as I woke up. haha

#13

If the Dev team were to make changes, rather than moving the current fish to try and remove overlap, I think it would be better to make it so that the old wilds fish need 2 components to catch them, something that won’t overlap with the legendary fish lures, like the wild component + rotten finger or feather so that those have more of a requirement and are still a “higher tier” of fish but will no longer interfere with the legendary fish, this will still leave things like common fish to interfere which we had in the old game, but that is less common already than the way it is right now, however I think it is fine how it is, you can get all of the legendary fish without overlap if you go to the right place

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#14

I’m still with Rickness on this one, even as a solo player I have managed to find spots to catch almost everything exclusively. Yes there is locations with overlaps, but is that a terrible thing? Only if its the only spot you know of. If you know spots you can fish without overlap then your just choosing how your lures are divided out.
Do I want multiple fish this time, or just that one?

If there was no spots with overlap I could sympathize with this. But as it stands, this is an ingredient for creating large batches of the top tier potions, of course it should be rare and hard to find, that makes both the potions and the fish itself have market value. This is an MMO not a single player game, you aren’t meant to be able to do everything yourself, and it’s meant to take time to learn things, especially on the heels of an expansion

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#15

I agree… As I’ve pointed out before, there are plenty of lure items out there to make there be no overlap between fish. Overlap just seems to be annoying

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#16

those jelmiry have been stubborn for me the past week at least, I keep sleeping in the middle of the day, I actually decided to just not go to sleep until after the bite, its coming up soon at least… so far its been about 21 hours since I got sleep, I cant wait to catch them and pass out :slight_smile: how much are you willing to pay for them metris? I could save some for you each day that I am awake at the right time, and you can turn them into potions with the time you would be spending catching them

#17

Yeap, I’m fully aware of that. I got way past 1k h in that game, after almost everyone of the eu-community went to pause in OG, fishing was basically becoming the only thing to do. In Reborn, we run shards 7-9 right now and use those potions like candies, and no one got the time, spending hours in dungeons at evenings, to spend the second half of the day searching fish to be able to play - which is why we craft singles, for the most part, it’s like the material is taken out for a good deal of the exact target group which actually can’t do without those potions.
I left other MMOs before, because they required exactly this, crafting and farming until evening, to be elligible to play the endgame, so basically they become your one and only job.

… and you missed the part where I stated it’s not on the market, since a long time now, not once. I am currently willing to pay 1500 dram per Jelmiry (@ all traders reading that), but I’m very, very sure that is way too few for the efforts of most fishers. All above is not worth it since the mats for singles are so much faster and cheaper to get and the 10x potions are pretty complicated, they got a higher risk to fail. Kylakin is at that prize atm, though, and it is so much easier to get.

… and the part where I wrote I know those people, they are - for the most part - members of big guilds and do not play in my timezone.

The thing is, I invested TONS of time, I even found spots where after a 2.5h-wait I can find Jelmiry, sometimes, and all I want is to not be screwed over with overlaps, additionally.

As for Wisher: “Yes there is locations with overlaps, but is that a terrible thing?” - if these are the only spawns supposedly, which you find during the time you can play, yes it is.

#18

I don’t know what to say man personally I stand with Rickness on this one as well I suppose. If all MMOs require this and it drives you away maybe MMO games just aren’t your cup of tea? I mean I don’t know what to say or offer to help. I hope you find a solution to your issue but I hope it doesn’t take away from the difficulty of catching the fish or its rarity in the promise. Good luck mate.

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#19

…you mean I should quit my job because every MMO requires that… well you didn’t seem to have tried as many as me (and overread again the part where I wrote I got 1k hours in Orbus even staying after everyone quit… “not my cup of tea” oh sure that must be it errr wait what :smiley: … ), but at least you made me smile a little :wink: …

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#20

Bye. Can I have your stuff?