I think some way of keeping track of your performance is essential in a great rpg… call me an elitest if you want, but i dont slam on others if there not playing the optimal way, i just like to have something tangible so i can physically see the improvements when getting new gear or leveling up ect. i read a previous post regarding dps meters creating a negative environment in random group play, but the fact is that already exists you can clearly see if someone is missing shots, failing spells, not getting aggro, and not healing enough, and if inclined one could call them out on it, with or without parse meters. if anything it would help players understand the level at which they are capable of playing. in any game there are casuals and people who take it a little more seriously in their approach to playing, and meters would help sort out who has dedicated the time to learn and perfect the class and who is just playin for kicks. I honestly think the reason WoW still has players playing is because of ranking sites like wowprogress, world of logs, and warcraft logs, it greatly enriches end game content, for those who just cant get enough.
Very true, DPS meters helped me back in wow days because it showed me I could do better and I did!
With little to no “ui”, I feel like this is supposed to be more of a “mmo sim” that a standard point and click mmo.
I like all the “mystery” around this game, its hard to find a level 1-20 walkthru, and I like it that way. I like having to figure out thing, and not just going with what some min/maxer on a popular spoiler guide has figured to be optimal set up for your class.
of course it would not be there as like a hud or somthing, i would assume it would live in the menu as its own tab, which can be viewed prior to combat ending or somthing… and i agree that its more fun to figure stuff out for yourself… but these min-maxers for the most part spend alot of time theory crafting and testing and create the standard for balancing within the game… i just feel its a very healthy rpg element that you just dont see in alot of games for some reason, and yet the king of rpgs (WoW) has had it since the very begining
I don’t think that they are essential for a great RPG, but I can see why some people would want them.
If they ever are a thing then it’s going to be more of a FF14 situation where it’s an external tool reading the output log or something like that, I don’t think we would ever reach a point where we had that level of UI modification in-game.
In addition, I would want to have a FF14-style policy about it, meaning if you want to use them for your own edification that’s fine, but it would be a violation of the CoC to basically go on a PuG dungeon run and then have a DPS meter running and start harassing the other DPS for not doing enough damage…
the idea can be scary but it will be fine. People who don’t do damage will stick out like a sore thumb. they’re slow, not in the right spot, potentially die often and typically clearly don’t know their class mechanics. but also good players stick out often. When you see a good player reach the monster and all of a sudden the health bar starts dropping in much larger chunks, or the mobs are organized properly by the gunner or mobs yanked properly etc. in WoW it was too hard to notice if you’re feral druid was dpsing or afk in mele range like i always was 
Logs you say? What might the path be to such a log? I live to parse!
There’s nothing in there worth parsing right now for this, but I may add those type of logs into it in the future and I’ll let the community know if I do.
WoW did not initially have threat meters and most people did not have dmg meters(Ref. World 2nd nefarian kill with of Medivh) This really was not an issue and added a layer pf expertise. As a rogue in the Vael fight, you could easily pull from the tank and one of the jobs of the Main Assist(dps all others target through/follow) was to dictate when to modulate dps on the boss. Frankly I really missed that when it was gone.
Nobody needed meters to weed out a bad dps back then, because if you know the game you can see if they are using the proper rotations or not. This is also really obvious in Orbus, since graphics and sound appear to show special attacks/abilities firing.
Also, WoW is definitely not still around due to raid log websites. The vast majority of wow players don’t even raid past LFR. As a raider for over a decade I have had to repeat countless times that nobody cares how the meters look if you don’t switch to adds, nobody cares if your numbers are high if you don’t interrupt the cast that keeps wiping the raid.
I don’t think meters would necessarily be bad, but to say they are super important or even required for a game’s playability or long term success just doesn’t agree with me. IMO we would be better off without them esp when we have target dummies to run combos and numbers on.
It would be great to have them for at least a training dummy to try out different rotations that were theory crafted.
Just watch your numbers or record in OBS to analyze later. I’ve had no problems just observing my numbers on the dummy and comparing rotations.
I like the lack of a DPS meter. Makes me focus on fight mechanics rather than just trying to top the leaderboard.
That is what I have been doing but is a pain in the ass, especially when you throw ice lance in there with 2 afflictions, very tough to see the dmg.
It’s true, such a tool would be used by Elite Jerks(tm?) to be jerks, and as a WOW guild lead even I had to remove a few people from raid because of low performance. But such a tool can be used for good. As the same guild lead, I used logs/dps meter and other similar tools to help guildmates improve and find their weak areas. We got better as a group from good data and analysis. Please count me as “yes, would like that feature”
Besides, I really want to see a graph over time of my spells attempted vs cast vs perfect cast. Esp for Frost 3… 
That’s only if you can see everyone’s dps, we don’t need it. What we want is just a personal tool which show your own dps.
Close! “Elitist Jerks” was the main theorycrafting website for WoW raiders in the early days. I think if a guild decides to focus on raiding it’s expected some may have to be removed, it isn’t personal and nobody should judge you for that if you did it in a kind way. I will say again IMO a good raid leader does not need DPS meters to see if someone is meeting potential or not, especially in a game without much stat balancing(chore I do not miss).
Totally get the desire for a personal one to make theorycrafting easier, but caution that once it’s out of the box all the good and bad that goes with it is inescapable, even if you make meters only personal. Still pretty torn on if it’s good or not…
w/e happens though, the game will still be awesome and i will play, with or without the meters great job devs
DPS meters just get people to judge specific members of their group as not doing enough damage and i find it pointless. Training dummys exist so you can see how your combo of skills and whatnot are doing in terms of damage and i think that’s enough. I guess being an older MMO generation that kind of stuff never was needed.
They are not “essential” at all and people have been doing without them in MMOs and this MMO just fine. Btw its online modded or modern day MMOs that have DPS meters, not any other type of RPG.
in all fairness if you group cant defeat a boss and you cant figure out why, the combat logs are the best place to start, if your groups healing is low, you will not kill a boss, you have now identified the problem and can take the steps needed to fix it… this is just theoretical of course as we dont know how hard the raid bosses will be ( if there are damage and healing requirments) and we also dont know how the talent tree system will work, there is too much we still dont know to make a judgemennt on wether or not dps meters will even be a relevent feature or not… but if the raid bosses are indeed difficult and the talent tree system does offer alternate ways to play each class… then being able to compile the combat logs would be a very handy tool for those trying to progress quickly through the content, and looking for the absolute best ways to do things… it seems to me the only reason anyone has presented to not have them is because of the grief that comes along with it… perhaps then it should be a limited feature aka you can only see your own dps or only see the dps of people in your fellowship or its a feature thats only available at a target dummy or in the highest difficulty of content, aka raids or hard mode dungeons… DPS meters also create a sort of competitiveness to pve that i know i really enjoy.
it would kind of take away from the immersion and change the orbus experience to more “i do more dps than you, my meter says so, so i must be better” kind of play
having the dps floating text helps but maybe that could be changed to be more clear or a combat log just showing hits
but a WoW dps style meter isn’t really necessary in my opinion
at the risk of sounding elitest, wouldnt doing more dps as a dps class actually mean you are better at dps’ing? i can see why people dislike the idea of that being truthful, but in a positive environment that just opens avenues for improvement.
currently i agree with you they are not at all necessary currently, they are only necessary if there is highly difficult content that requires a certain level of play, which currently there is not. But that just goes bback to my OP that meters are essential for an rpg to be great, the relevance of parsing indicates there is very dificult content in the game. which i also think is essential for a great rpg.
Perhaps my title was a little too straight forward for the point i was trying to make…
Great RPG’s have highly difficult content, which makes the log parsing essential, it creates so much depth with information that is already there, you just make it available.