not quite, its more of trying to make it so other classes are useful and balancing new additions to the content can be easier with out the likes of alphabet complaining that its too easy for them because they have the top mages. If the content was balanced in the way it would be with no balancing to the most over-powered talent in the game you would often hit dps wall or find stuff close to that. I’m not saying it doesn’t suck but the other classes have a limit to how much dps they can do. personally I would like a buff to the other dps as well (and bard, you cant hit half the bosses sitting down as well as numerous other issues making it not as viable for most content in comparison to muski)
1 Like
We will be rolling out a change to the Triplicity talent on Tues Oct 1st so we can gather information from the community ahead of the Oct 8th Shard dungeon level increase
Is this permanent then? This is very discouraging to hear we have a diminishing return to something we spent hundreds of hours practicing. If i can hit 17+ fireballs in a triplicity, i should be rewarded, not punished. If this takes a significant amount of DPS out of the runemage class (which it very well may, as the diminishing return starts at a lowly FIVE ← Really low!!!) then i can see this getting huge backlash, not only from the top mages, but all runemages.
You have built a very skill oriented class, i hope it stays that way, its the reason i play. Of course, this will need to be tested, to see how it really effects runemages. My concern is that you will take too much damage away from runemages, resulting in a class that takes an absurd amount of time, skill and dedication for something achievable with a very small fraction of the effort with other classes.
without having to make the damage requirements too high for some and too low for others
Its my personal opinion, but likely similar with the other runemages, if the top runemages find the damage requirement too low, it should be that way. They have the skill, strategy, etc to do so, i wouldnt want to see their efforts watered down, mine included.
In otherwords, i feel as though it is already balanced. Sure, top DPS runemages have high DPS, but the skill required to pull it off is proportional. Please take this class very seriously, as it is a sensitive subject for the community, and i hope you listen to our feedback on the changes.
2 Likes
Well I’m not, but I know how to play the classes I’ve worked hard on
I hate to change topic, but since mage has sorta been the meatshield for all the other classes, what’s going to get nerfed next 
Start a new topic for that… Lets keep this about the current topic.
1 Like
i think you guys should fix the other runemage talent like the speed talent and the true afliction then working on the triplicicty talent
There is a cap on every single other class. Runemage is still not capped. It’s still exponential only lowered the exponential growth. As I said intended, Justified, get on with it. This Thread is not going to rollback a change they’re making
Sure you can distance yourself from “top runemages” but the matter of question is tho:
Did the “top runemages” practice their ass off getting to that skill level?
If someone practices that much they should be rewarded, I don’t think anyone will try to disagree with that. But if they practiced that much, and they achieve that much, wouldn’t it be logical that someone who’s OVERLY prepared should find “hard content” easier than the rest of the population?
Perhaps it was too much compared to the other populace? Trying to tune to “alphabet standards”.
Then maybe they should tune to midcore players then.
1 Like
I still don’t get why everyone thinks triplicity is exponential dps gain. Where is the math backing this idea?
As a caster casting about 17-18 in triplicity I get a 17% total dps increase with a uptime of slightly above 50%.
how is 17% dps increase exponential?
the faster you cast the more triplicity is up, the faster you cast the more you benefit from it. do I need to pull out 4th grade math to make this make sense?
But is the increase exponential?
Base value of a caster perfect rotation with perfect 2.25 spells per second
5k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 5k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 5k, 5k, 0
207.2/6.6666
31.1k dps
0, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 20k
334.4/8.4444
39.6k dps
6.66666+8.4444=15.1111
551.6k total damage in one rotation [normal and with tripilicty] within 15.1111 seconds meaning:
36.5k total dps.
Triplicity did 39.6k dps by itself, normal did 31.1k by itself.
14.8% dmg increase?
31.1k doing normal/ how much total dps triplcity added to the whole rotation 36.5k
2.25 -2.375 spells per second is about the HUMAN/game cap people are facing (limitations on the human body and game/inputlagg)
[Afflictions made into 5k as the afflictions dots are removed from the equation (as they add dps even to triplicity)]
the two 0’s are: triplcity start up (ressurect) and triplcity start (polymorph)
Any buffs you add onto it (tiles+talent buffs) are added porportionally to it meaning the 14.8% dmg increase is going to remain the same no matter the different scenario [if someone uses +3 wand with the same no buffs etc] they’ll still see 14.8% dmg increase with the same speed.
I just calculated casting 17 in triplcity as a counter (2.125 cast speed instead of 2.25 cast speed)
5k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 5k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 5k, 5k, 0
207.2/7.0589
Meaning:
29.353k dps in normal
0, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 13.6k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 20k, 20k,
314.4/8.471
meaning:
37.115k dps in triplcity
Total damage of:
521.6k in 15.5299 seconds (longer and less damage as well)
33.587k total dps.
29.353/33.587= 12.6% damage increase
12.6% vs 14.8% damage increase from triplicity. (17 vs 18)
how is the difference exponential there?
If casting faster meant it was exponential then tell me the factor of which it is.
1 Like
I don’t understand why anyone is wasting their time arguing. The devs don’t make mistakes, thus no changing their minds.
Burnator made a formula for how much you cast → how much dps you get out of it. (Not accounting for affliction dots)
It’s a linear one under perfect conditions.
This is an exponential line.
Sorry I must be blind it must be exponential.
I’m still under the impression that other classes should just have no caps.
Why is rapidity ranger capped by being able to only shoot 1 damage arrows if they go too fast? Just uncap it, and similarly have it so timing and precision if rangers hit critical spots they get another one instantly, having potential for 100% critical spot uptime.
The reason why scoundrels are seeing bad dps is becase people’s Rank 5 curve uptime is low, and lack of good working tiles.
If balancing due to lack of caps is too hard for the devs, they should tune it to the “average” or upper end of the “average”. That way people who work hard can ACTUALLY get rewarded for their efforts while still having content to tune.
2 Likes
I agree, but you know it feels like a punch in the gut for people who have practiced for so long
Most of this thread seems to come down to 2 viewpoints:
- (Mostly) people who play mage, at a variety of skill levels, and who don’t want diminishing returns.
- People who don’t play mage and want to restrict the skill/damage distribution of mage
I’ve seen a lot of arguments based on the belief that mage’s wide skill/damage distribution is a bad thing, and mage should be like the other classes with a limit. I believe in the complete opposite of this. Strong returns to change in skill is a sign of depth in the class. It doesn’t mean that mage is too hard for new players to get into or unfair for slower mages, because everyone can improve themselves and see real results. Mage is the most popular DPS class; plenty of people give it a try and level it to 30.
I started playing mage because of the idea of the runecasting system. I continue playing mage over a year later because of how my raw skill and practice translate to tangible returns. I think that a lot of the mage population plays mage because of the ability to improve.
I understand that people want to be able to compete with mages in damage as other classes, particularly ranger. However, this change is not a nerf. This is a mechanical change that will limit the reward we can achieve with skill relative to other mages. It may make balancing easier, but it goes against the principle that makes mage unique and worthwhile in the long run.
By all means, balance the classes so that DPS is more even. I don’t want to be the only one pulling DPS in a party of similarly skilled but different class players. I’d rather that everyone can equally contribute to a fight when they are all equally skilled. However, the last thing I want is to be easily replaceable by any bad or average player. There should be a wide damage gap based on skill; it’s what encourages average players to become great ones.
This update mechanically changes the class to normalize good and bad mages. Balance between classes is an entirely separate issue. I think most mages, the people affected by this update, agree that the skill/damage distribution is a core component of what makes the class fun and shouldn’t be changed.
3 Likes
that wide skill gap is what makes balance impossible. They are making this change for the sole purpose of reducing that skill gap. that’s the point.
It’s not impossible at all. This has been discussed over and over again. It’s just more difficult. To make it easier, giving other classes similar damage ranges allows the devs to match the endpoints of those similar ranges. Alternatively, smaller damage ranges can be lined up close to the larger mage range.
Whatever the reason is for making this change, it has a very negative effect on the best part of mage for players of all skill level.
1 Like
this thread is ridiculous, its just an alphabet circle jerk to complain and get a giant thread the devs will half read because of its size in your hope that they’ll think there are alot of people against this change, when there isn’t. there are 2 people complaining
There is plenty of valuable discussion in here. Furthermore, there are far more than 2 mages who are up in arms about this mechanics change and plenty of people outside Alphabet.